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 Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills

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RedyreRotties
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 1:30 pm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcoholism

Quote :

Alcoholism, also known as alcohol dependence,[1][2] is a disabling addictive disorder. It is characterized by compulsive and uncontrolled consumption of alcohol despite its negative effects on the drinker's health, relationships, and social standing. Like other drug addictions, alcoholism is medically defined as a treatable disease.[3] The term "alcoholism" is a widely used term first coined in 1849 by Magnus Huss, but in medicine the term was replaced by "alcohol abuse" and "alcohol dependence" in the 1980s DSM III.[4] Similarly in 1979 an expert World Health Organisation committee disfavoured the use of "alcoholism" as a diagnostic entity, preferring the category of "alcohol dependence syndrome".[5] In the 19th and early 20th centuries, alcohol dependence was called dipsomania before the term "alcoholism" replaced it.[6]

The biological mechanisms underpinning alcoholism are uncertain, however, risk factors include social environment, stress,[7] mental health, genetic predisposition, age, ethnic group, and sex.[8][9] Long-term alcohol abuse produces physiological changes in the brain such as tolerance and physical dependence. Such brain chemistry changes maintain the alcoholic's compulsive inability to stop drinking and result in alcohol withdrawal syndrome upon discontinuation of alcohol consumption.[10] Alcohol damages almost every organ in the body, including the brain; because of the cumulative toxic effects of chronic alcohol abuse, the alcoholic risks suffering a range of medical and psychiatric disorders.[11] Alcoholism has profound social consequences for alcoholics and the people of their lives.[12][13]

Alcoholism is the cyclic presence of tolerance, withdrawal, and excessive alcohol use; the drinker's inability to control such compulsive drinking, despite awareness of its harm to his or her health, indicate that the person might be an alcoholic.[14] Questionnaire-based screening is a method of detecting harmful drinking patterns, including alcoholism.[15] Alcohol detoxification is conducted to withdraw the alcoholic person from drinking alcohol, usually with cross-tolerance drugs, e.g. benzodiazepines to manage withdrawal symptoms.[16] Post-medical care, such as group therapy, or self-help groups, usually is required to maintain alcoholic abstention.[17][18] Often, alcoholics also are addicted to other drugs, most often benzodiazepines, which might require additional medical treatment.[19] The alcoholic woman is more sensitive to alcohol's deleterious physical, cerebral, and mental effects, and increased social stigma, in relation to a man, for being an alcoholic.[20][21] The World Health Organisation estimates that there are 140 million alcoholics worldwide.[
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 1:31 pm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigotry

Quote :

A bigot is a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices. The correct use of the term requires the elements of intolerance, irrationality, and animosity toward those of differing beliefs.

The term has evolved to refer to persons hostile to people of differing race, ethnicity, nationality, sexual orientation, religion in modern English usage.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 1:32 pm

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/alcoholism/ds00340

Quote :

Definition
By Mayo Clinic staff

Alcoholism is a chronic disease in which your body becomes dependent on alcohol. When you have alcoholism, you lose control over your drinking. You may not be able to control when you drink, how much you drink, or how long you drink on each occasion. If you have alcoholism, you continue to drink even though you know it's causing problems with your relationships, health, work or finances.

It's possible to have a problem with alcohol but not have all the symptoms of alcoholism. This is known as "alcohol abuse," which means you drink too much and it causes problems in your life although you aren't completely dependent on alcohol. If you have alcoholism or you abuse alcohol, you may not be able to cut back or quit without help. A number of approaches are available to help you recover from alcoholism, including medications, counseling and self-help groups.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:00 pm

Is it just "me" or our we off topic once again??? This IS getting silly... :roll:
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PostSubject: Dog Farms   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:04 pm

Actually I side tracked the conversation. Did you know that drunks, Pets and animal Abuse quite often go hand in hand. A lot of individuals feel that an individual who abuses an animal should face the death penalty or spend the rest of their life in jail. Well how about the drunk that is passed out on the sofa for 2 days while their livestock (horses, cows, sheep etc.) stand in -50 degree weather waiting to be fed so their body has the nourishment to make heat to keep warm. Or how about the Drunk who severely disciplines their dog as it doesn't perform during a training session, or does badly in a show or agility tournament. Or the drunk that leaves the dog crated for 20 hours because their to busy doing what comes naturally - drinking - or they forget to feed and water same for a day or two. Or the dog that suffers from an extended bladder from holding their urine waiting for the Drunk to wake up and let it out to do its business, who desperately tries not to have an accident in the house for fear of the disciplinary repercussions. Or how about the bottle tipper that does not provide their animal with vet care such as shots, teeth cleaning, or any other treatment that may require medicial attention because they have no money - after all their is another priority - the almighty bottle. There are many forms of animal abuse that do not fall within the guidelines set out by the Criminal Code or Department of Agriculture. You people aid the drunk by allowing them to use the excuse that alcoholism is a disease - sorry don't buy that -its a choice and like so many of you who believe the animal abuser should face the death penalty - I believe a drunks place is beneath the grass not on top. And Red your copy and posted definination of a "Bigot" I take was for my benefit, maybe fits partially, but at least I stand by my convictions and can honestly say that I am no animal or dog abuser . Again A person HAS THE CHOICE AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THEY CHOOSE TO DRINK.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:05 pm

RedyreRotties wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bigotry

Quote :

A bigot is a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices. The correct use of the term requires the elements of intolerance, irrationality, and animosity toward those of differing beliefs.

The term has evolved to refer to persons hostile to people of differing race, ethnicity, nationality, sexual orientation, religion in modern English usage.

HuH, really, now that's interesting! To thine ownself be true, I guess! :idea:
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:09 pm

ram wrote:
Actually I side tracked the conversation. Did you know that drunks, Pets and animal Abuse quite often go hand in hand. A lot of individuals feel that an individual who abuses an animal should face the death penalty or spend the rest of their life in jail. Well how about the drunk that is passed out on the sofa for 2 days while their livestock (horses, cows, sheep etc.) stand in -50 degree weather waiting to be fed so their body has the nourishment to make heat to keep warm. Or how about the Drunk who severely disciplines their dog as it doesn't perform during a training session, or does badly in a show or agility tournament. Or the drunk that leaves the dog crated for 20 hours because their to busy doing what comes naturally - drinking - or they forget to feed and water same for a day or two. Or the dog that suffers from an extended bladder from holding their urine waiting for the Drunk to wake up and let it out to do its business, who desperately tries not to have an accident in the house for fear of the disciplinary repercussions. Or how about the bottle tipper that does not provide their animal with vet care such as shots, teeth cleaning, or any other treatment that may require medicial attention because they have no money - after all their is another priority - the almighty bottle. There are many forms of animal abuse that do not fall within the guidelines set out by the Criminal Code or Department of Agriculture. You people aid the drunk by allowing them to use the excuse that alcoholism is a disease - sorry don't buy that -its a choice and like so many of you who believe the animal abuser should face the death penalty - I believe a drunks place is beneath the grass not on top. And Red your copy and posted definination of a "Bigot" I take was for my benefit, maybe fits partially, but at least I stand by my convictions and can honestly say that I am no animal or dog abuser . Again A person HAS THE CHOICE AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THEY CHOOSE TO DRINK.

Your comments are REPUGNANT.

THIS IS FROM THE MAYO CLINIC. Perhaps you have better information than they do?

Quote :
Alcoholism is a chronic disease in which your body becomes dependent on alcohol. When you have alcoholism, you lose control over your drinking. You may not be able to control when you drink, how much you drink, or how long you drink on each occasion. If you have alcoholism, you continue to drink even though you know it's causing problems with your relationships, health, work or finances.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:13 pm

It's possible to have a problem with alcohol but not have all the symptoms of alcoholism. This is known as "alcohol abuse," which means you drink too much and it causes problems in your life although you aren't completely dependent on alcohol. If you have alcoholism or you abuse alcohol, you may not be able to cut back or quit without help. A number of approaches are available to help you recover from alcoholism, including medications, counseling and self-help groups


This particular part is redundant. It's contradictory. - scratch
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:14 pm

RedyreRotties wrote:
ram wrote:
Actually I side tracked the conversation. Did you know that drunks, Pets and animal Abuse quite often go hand in hand. A lot of individuals feel that an individual who abuses an animal should face the death penalty or spend the rest of their life in jail. Well how about the drunk that is passed out on the sofa for 2 days while their livestock (horses, cows, sheep etc.) stand in -50 degree weather waiting to be fed so their body has the nourishment to make heat to keep warm. Or how about the Drunk who severely disciplines their dog as it doesn't perform during a training session, or does badly in a show or agility tournament. Or the drunk that leaves the dog crated for 20 hours because their to busy doing what comes naturally - drinking - or they forget to feed and water same for a day or two. Or the dog that suffers from an extended bladder from holding their urine waiting for the Drunk to wake up and let it out to do its business, who desperately tries not to have an accident in the house for fear of the disciplinary repercussions. Or how about the bottle tipper that does not provide their animal with vet care such as shots, teeth cleaning, or any other treatment that may require medicial attention because they have no money - after all their is another priority - the almighty bottle. There are many forms of animal abuse that do not fall within the guidelines set out by the Criminal Code or Department of Agriculture. You people aid the drunk by allowing them to use the excuse that alcoholism is a disease - sorry don't buy that -its a choice and like so many of you who believe the animal abuser should face the death penalty - I believe a drunks place is beneath the grass not on top. And Red your copy and posted definination of a "Bigot" I take was for my benefit, maybe fits partially, but at least I stand by my convictions and can honestly say that I am no animal or dog abuser . Again A person HAS THE CHOICE AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THEY CHOOSE TO DRINK.

Your comments are REPUGNANT.

THIS IS FROM THE MAYO CLINIC. Perhaps you have better information than they do?

Quote :
Alcoholism is a chronic disease in which your body becomes dependent on alcohol. When you have alcoholism, you lose control over your drinking. You may not be able to control when you drink, how much you drink, or how long you drink on each occasion. If you have alcoholism, you continue to drink even though you know it's causing problems with your relationships, health, work or finances.
I'm just trying to figure out how the rant has turned to animal abuse? scratch
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:15 pm

Read more here: http://alcoholism.about.com/cs/info2/a/aa022697.htm

Quote :
One of the difficulties in recognizing alcoholism as a disease is it just plain doesn't seem like one. It doesn't look, sound, smell and it certainly doesn't act like a disease. To make matters worse, generally it denies it exists and resists treatment.

Alcoholism has been recognized for many years by professional medical organizations as a primary, chronic, progressive and sometimes fatal disease. The National Council on Alcoholism and Drug Dependence offers a detailed and complete definition of alcoholism, but probably the most simple way to describe it is "a mental obsession that causes a physical compulsion to drink."

Mental obsession? Did you ever wake up in the morning with a song playing over and over in your head? It might have been a commercial jingle you heard on television, or a song from the radio, but it kept playing ... and playing and playing.

Mental Obsession
Remember what that was like? No matter what you did, that silly tune kept on playing. You could try to whistle or sing another song or turn on the radio and listen to another tune, but the one in your head just kept on playing. Think about it. There was something going on in your mind that you didn't put there and, no matter how hard you tried, couldn't get out!

That is an example of a simple mental obsession -- a thought process over which you have no control. Such is the nature of the disease of alcoholism. When the drinking "song" starts playing in the mind of an alcoholic, he is powerless. He didn't put the song there and the only way to get it to stop is to take another drink.

The problem is the alcoholic's mental obsession with alcohol is much more subtle than a song playing in his mind. In fact, he may not even know it's there. All he knows is he suddenly has an urge to take a drink -- a physical compulsion to drink.

Progressive Disease
Compounding the problem is the progressive nature of the disease. In its early stages, taking one or two drinks may be all it takes to get the "song" to stop. But soon it takes six or seven and later maybe ten or twelve. Somewhere down the road the only time the song stops is when he passes out.

The progression of the disease is so subtle and usually takes place over such an extended period of time, that even the alcoholic himself failed to notice the point at which he lost control -- and alcohol took over -- his life.

No wonder denial is an almost universal symptom of the disease. For those who have come to the realization that they do have a problem, help may be as close as the white pages of the telephone directory. But for those who need help and do not want it, intervention may be the only alternative.
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PostSubject: Dog Farms   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:17 pm

So you beleive in aiding and abetting the drunk by allowing them to use the excuse that alcholism is a disease so they don't have to take responsability for their actions or for the decisions they make or the distruction they create. BULL SHIT
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:17 pm

http://www.niaaa.nih.gov/FAQs/General-English/

Quote :
1. What is alcoholism?

Alcoholism, also known as alcohol dependence, is a disease that includes the following four symptoms:

* Craving--A strong need, or urge, to drink.
* Loss of control--Not being able to stop drinking once drinking has begun.
* Physical dependence--Withdrawal symptoms, such as nausea, sweating, shakiness, and anxiety after stopping drinking.
* Tolerance--The need to drink greater amounts of alcohol to get "high."

For clinical and research purposes, formal diagnostic criteria for alcoholism also have been developed. Such criteria are included in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fourth Edition, published by the American Psychiatric Association, as well as in the International Classification Diseases, published by the World Health Organization. (See also "Publications," Alcohol Alert No. 30: Diagnostic Criteria for Alcohol Abuse and Dependence.)

2. Is alcoholism a disease?

Yes, alcoholism is a disease. The craving that an alcoholic feels for alcohol can be as strong as the need for food or water. An alcoholic will continue to drink despite serious family, health, or legal problems.

Like many other diseases, alcoholism is chronic, meaning that it lasts a person's lifetime; it usually follows a predictable course; and it has symptoms. The risk for developing alcoholism is influenced both by a person's genes and by his or her lifestyle. (See also "Publications," Alcohol Alert No. 30: Diagnostic Criteria for Alcohol Abuse and Dependence.)

3. Is alcoholism inherited?

Research shows that the risk for developing alcoholism does indeed run in families. The genes a person inherits partially explain this pattern, but lifestyle is also a factor. Currently, researchers are working to discover the actual genes that put people at risk for alcoholism. Your friends, the amount of stress in your life, and how readily available alcohol is also are factors that may increase your risk for alcoholism.

But remember: Risk is not destiny. Just because alcoholism tends to run in families doesn't mean that a child of an alcoholic parent will automatically become an alcoholic too. Some people develop alcoholism even though no one in their family has a drinking problem. By the same token, not all children of alcoholic families get into trouble with alcohol. Knowing you are at risk is important, though, because then you can take steps to protect yourself from developing problems with alcohol. (See also "Publications," A Family History of Alcoholism - Are You at Risk?; Alcohol Alert No. 18: The Genetics of Alcoholism.)

4. Can alcoholism be cured?

No, alcoholism cannot be cured at this time. Even if an alcoholic hasn't been drinking for a long time, he or she can still suffer a relapse. Not drinking is the safest course for most people with alcoholism.

5. Can alcoholism be treated?

Yes, alcoholism can be treated. Alcoholism treatment programs use both counseling and medications to help a person stop drinking. Treatment has helped many people stop drinking and rebuild their lives. (See also "Publication," Alcohol Alert No. 49: New Advances in Alcoholism Treatment.)
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:17 pm

A person that neglects their animals that badly needn't be a drunk to do so. There are a lot of animal abusers out there that do so without the aid of a bottle.

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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:19 pm

ram wrote:
So you beleive in aiding and abetting the drunk by allowing them to use the excuse that alcholism is a disease so they don't have to take responsability for their actions or for the decisions they make or the distruction they create. BULL SHIT
No, I expect that once they know they have a problem they get help for it.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:20 pm

I have more experience than I would like to with person's close to me who have substance abuse issues.

Ram, your comments make me feel that you may be a closet addict yourself. Lots of rage in your posts. Gotta be some reason for that.

The overwhelming abundance of information corroborates the fact that ALCOHOLISM is a TREATABLE DISEASE.

Too bad bigotry isn't.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:20 pm

ram wrote:
You people aid the drunk by allowing them to use the excuse that alcoholism is a disease - sorry don't buy that -its a choice and like so many of you who believe the animal abuser should face the death penalty - I believe a drunks place is beneath the grass not on top. And Red your copy and posted definination of a "Bigot" I take was for my benefit, maybe fits partially, but at least I stand by my convictions and can honestly say that I am no animal or dog abuser . Again A person HAS THE CHOICE AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THEY CHOOSE TO DRINK.

Ram, seriously, stop. You aren't the only one reading this thread who has "issues" concerning alcoholics. I'm not sure how damaged you are, but others do have feelings also. I tell you, mine are bordering on very angry.

Whether alcoholism is considered a disease or considered a disease simply because there are underlying mental issues is not really what bothers me. Your attitude that people like my parents belong "beneath the grass not on top" does. How dare you weigh in such harsh judgement. Their lives had no value? Yes, they chose to begin drinking for reasons beyond my understanding, but it WAS an addiction and, in the end, beyond their control or choice.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:38 pm

GypsyJazmine wrote:
ram wrote:
So you beleive in aiding and abetting the drunk by allowing them to use the excuse that alcholism is a disease so they don't have to take responsability for their actions or for the decisions they make or the distruction they create. BULL SHIT
No, I expect that once they know they have a problem they get help for it.

I wish that were true, GJ, but unfortunately, many don't. They blame others for their drinking, they re-act very defensively with all the stats, they say they can stop without help, (some can) - and bringing up the topic of alcoholism will cause them to become very angry, as they are in denial. So most of the time, there is no way to discuss their problem with them. Until they hit "thier" bottom, whatever, wherever that may be, they will never admit to having an issue with alcoholism. It's very sad. And more than anything, terrible hard on those that love them.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:48 pm

RedyreRotties wrote:
I have more experience than I would like to with person's close to me who have substance abuse issues.

Ram, your comments make me feel that you may be a closet addict yourself. Lots of rage in your posts. Gotta be some reason for that.

The overwhelming abundance of information corroborates the fact that ALCOHOLISM is a TREATABLE DISEASE.

Too bad bigotry isn't.

You speak of bigotry, yet you write this post? "closet addict" lots of rage" etc., Pot meet kettle?

All the statistics you have posted are upsetting to many of us. If you've been that close to an "addict" then you should know better! I for one can't even read them.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:51 pm

nicki, I think you have a basic problem with comprehension skills.

There is nothing remotely resembling bigotry in my post that you quoted. Do you know what the word means?
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 2:54 pm

ram wrote:
So you beleive in aiding and abetting the drunk by allowing them to use the excuse that alcholism is a disease so they don't have to take responsability for their actions or for the decisions they make or the distruction they create. BULL SHIT

Sweetie.. unless you've ever had to deal personally with someone who has an addictive disorder you can't claim its an "excuse" or "bullshit" without making yourself look like an idiot.



Now I will take my own addictive disorder back over to facebook and enjoy my beer and smoke without having to read such nonsense on here. 8)
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PostSubject: Dog Farms   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 3:27 pm

First of all Sweetie - I have dealt with a drunk for more than 16 years and they are resting quit comfortably on the other side of the grass. So my opinion about drinking being a choice is very valid. An RED you comment about me being a closet drunk - don't think so - might have 5-6 drinks a year - don't care for the taste. To prove my point you can come here anytime and you will find unopened bottles of Vodka, Gin, Rum and Rye in my basement which were left over from my wedding in 1975. There are other uses for it other than drinking it - Vodka mixed with water makes an excellent glass cleaner but you don't want to hear that. Given all the copy and posting you've done Red to justify alcoholism is a disease I have to ask - Do you have a Drinking Problem???
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 3:38 pm

No, I don't. However, several people I know closely do/have issues with alcohol and other substance abuse.

One person close to me has lost their entire life, lost custody of a child, ruined their body, due to prescription and street drug abuse. This person has been to inhouse treatment several times, and did not have success in overcoming their addiction.

Another person close to me has serious problems with alcohol and live life in denial of it.

Your comments about people who have drinking problems are offensive to any compassionate rational person. One does not have to have a drinking problem to be compassionate about those who do.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 3:41 pm

ram wrote:
First of all Sweetie - I have dealt with a drunk for more than 16 years and they are resting quit comfortably on the other side of the grass. So my opinion about drinking being a choice is very valid. An RED you comment about me being a closet drunk - don't think so - might have 5-6 drinks a year - don't care for the taste. To prove my point you can come here anytime and you will find unopened bottles of Vodka, Gin, Rum and Rye in my basement which were left over from my wedding in 1975. There are other uses for it other than drinking it - Vodka mixed with water makes an excellent glass cleaner but you don't want to hear that. Given all the copy and posting you've done Red to justify alcoholism is a disease I have to ask - Do you have a Drinking Problem???


No, It's an opinion you are welcomed to have though it isn't valid.
I have had to deal with "drunks" my whole life, Some who right up until they had to quit thought their drinking was their choice until they figured out the hard way its only a choice to Start, when a person has an addictive personality disorder which most "drunks" have once you start its no longer a choice but a need, drunks "need" their drink to be able to get through the day.

For those who have addictive personality disorders be it for drinking, drugs, gambling, sex.. whatever once you start an addiction there is no such thing as it being a "choice" to stop or keep going there is only keep going until you either die or someone else steps in and makes you stop and you're left wishing you were dead.

But feel free to keep posting that its a choice, I never would have pegged you for an idiot but guess this is one of them times i'll be proven wrong.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 4:25 pm

I so tried to stay out of this topic..

I do not have any experience with alcoholism.

But I think their are people with addicting personalities. I also think there might be a chemical link in our own brains to make these problems more.

I don't think one grows up and says I want to be a drug addict or many other things that happen.

I think chemicals in our bodies play a huge roll. Beating addictions, is some of the toughest things you can do.. Whether smoking or gambling. ANd yes any addiction destroys lifes.
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   Tue 15 Jun 2010, 5:13 pm

feathers wrote:
ram wrote:
Alcoholism is not a disease - IT IS A CHOICE - I choose to smoke because I enjoy it, a drunk chooses to drink to escape life, a drug addict chooses to toke or smoke so they can take a trip without ever leaving their home. Only a drunk justifies their drinking by saying alcoholism is a disease. To bad the courts don't recognize that BS. Its a choice, has always been a choice and always will be a choice its an avenue someone uses to escape life If they hate life that much that they have to escape it day after day then they shouldn't be here. Just the same as it is my choice to smoke - I do so because I enjoy it - but it doesn't alter my mental state to such a point that I escape reality, or neglect my day to day responsibilities of caring for this farm and the animals within it. A Disease is something that infects an individual - something they could not prevent - something they did not deliberately try and catch - it just happens.

I have to agree with you on alcoholism I went to therapy with my husband for years trying to help him stop drinking. He would stop for years but all ways it was his choice to start again .
One of the first things they give the family who is involved with a family member who has addiction is a profile of people with addictions . One of the things about people with addictions are they are very self centered people . Their ,needs,wants,pleasures, all ways comes first. They crave attention very self centered . Face it substance abuse doesn't do any thing for any one else only the weak minded fool doing it .

I lost respect for the both of you. My dad drank, didn't really become an alcoholic until he came home from Iraq. He is dead now. He died from cirrhosis of the liver, my mother believes he drank because of PTSD all the crap he saw over there, there wasn't a lot of help from the military in the early 90's. My father was not self centered! neither was he a fool! If anyone is a fool it is you two...
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PostSubject: Re: Addictions-- Split from Puppy peddles and puppy mills   

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